Answering Marriage Seller Assertions, Talking Points, and Questions - Part 14

 

Read Part 1 here and Part 2 here and Part 3 here and Part 4 here and Part 5 here and Part 6 here and Part 7 here and Part 8 here and Part 9 here and Part 10 here. and Part 11 here and Part 12 here and Part 13 here.


Married people have more children, and we need more people. They are a resource.

The main reason married people have more children is the same reason they are married:

Either they believe they are supposed to be married and having children or they believe they have stability in their relationship.

In the Western world, there is very little, if any, stigma left in unmarried parenting.

Again, depending on your situation, there are different way to answer.

A) I don't want any/more children.

B) I can't have any/more children.

C) Water wells are a resource. How many have you personally dug? Food is a resource. Are you producing on a farm more than you're consuming? Food and water are resources yet you don't tell me I should be providing them. Other people will continue to provide children. I will continue to contribute in ways I prefer.

D) People can have as many children as they want without a terrible state contract.

E) I am not obligated to keep supplying to your government ponzi schemes.

F) Be honest and direct and try to encourage people to have more children, rather than telling them they should marry. You can appeal to the people who are already married to have (more) children, if you have a qualm with unmarried parenting.


Don't you want what is good for society?

This makes the assumption that marrying is good for society. You can try asking them to explain how exactly marrying is good for society. They will probably cite things we've already covered in this series: having (more) children, having cooperative parental involvement in raising the children, unmarried men being violent, and unmarried women being dependent on government. As we've shown, all of those things can be addressed without a terrible state contract.

A) The claims that getting a terrible state contract is good for society is based on perceived correlations or things that can be done without a terrible state contract. Signing a terrible state contract isn't good for society. What's good for society is in how people behave. It won't benefit society if I get a terrible state contract, other than to remove a woman from the teat of government. But I wouldn't take on a woman like that anyway. How about encouraging women to be independent?

B) Explain exactly how me entering into a terrible state contract would benefit society?

There is no evidence whatsoever that signing a terrible state contract is beneficial to society.

How to Keep Your Friends Free - Rescue, Recovery, and Restoration

Despite your best efforts with Prevention and Intervention, some of the guys you know are going to sacrifice themselves for what will likely be a lost cause. They're going to get married, or shack up, or otherwise entangle themselves in a woman's life in a way that gives away their freedom. Or maybe they did so before you had the chance to even try to instill in them the value of freedom.

The good news is that many of those guys will be dumped or will escape, and thus gain back some of their freedom, albeit heavily damaged and, often, compelled to make ongoing payments.

That's where you come in with the rescue, recovery, and restoration.

Of course, this depends on you having either stayed in contact or having left the door open. If these guys can't find you or don't think you want to hear from them, you're not going to be able to help.

 

Hopefully, if you knew them before they climbed down that ladder and were able to warn them, they'll remember that while so many other people were encouraging them to make what was perhaps the worst change they've ever volunteered to make, YOU were telling them the truth, even if they didn't like hearing it.

I've written about this before, but that was with a focus on you. I'm expanding here on what you can do for these guys. Some of these guys will have forgotten how to live as Free Men, or how to enjoy life, or even make their own decisions.

• If you can, and you don't have reason to believe he'll become a permanent mooch, offer him a place to crash.
  
  
• Refer him to a good family law attorney, if he doesn't have one, and if he needs one. He WILL need one if he was married, has a child, or co-mingled accounts/assets with her.
   
• If he seems to need it, refer him to a good Free Man-friendly therapist.
  
  
• Get him back to having fun doing the things he enjoys doing. Don't be discouraged if he doesn't seem to be immediately enjoying himself. He might not have given himself permission to enjoy his freedom yet. Yes, there are some things he may never resume, but he needs to at least give himself the opportunity.
  
  
• Listen carefully to what he says. Try to listen as much as possible, but you might need to point out, even interrupt him when he talking to remind him, that he is reclaiming his freedom, and to stop thinking like a husband. He needs to stop limiting himself and deferring to her or what she wanted. She doesn't get to decide anymore, and can't punish him anymore.
  
  
• If he ever talks about missing her or wanted to try to work it out with her, remind him of the terrible things she did and that going back to her would be throwing away the freedom and autonomy he's regained.
  
  
• There is the risk of him thinking "Maybe it was just her." The risk of him feeling like he has to be a husband. Consult the Prevention entry of this series. Go back to the basics. Especially if he has kids, it's even more important to stay as free as he can. Also, second marriages or marriages in which there are stepchildren have a much higher divorce rate. His children don't need the chaos having new women to meet. He needs to keep any involvement with new women very casual.
  
  
• He might miss the sex, even if it was infrequent and bland. He needs to know how to run game or sublimate.
  
  
• Set up regular get-togethers and outings, especially on Fridays and Saturdays, either with a group of guys or just the two of you. The more fun a recovering man has as a Free Man, the better!
  

This is the end of the series for now, although I will probably write and entry that addresses how to apply this when dealing with your own son.

How to Keep Your Friends Free - Prevention

How to Keep Your Friends Free - Intervention

Why Men Date Single Mothers

Inspired by this comment, I'm going to explain why some men date single mothers. For some men, more than one of these reasons will apply. These are in no particular order.

1) It never entered his mind that there are alternatives. He's taking what he thinks he can get or what has been offered to him. He doesn't realize that with a little game, he could find women who are childfree, and how much better for him that would be. He could even be desperate. Maybe he thinks that, if he has kids, he should date women with kids, but having his own kids should be all the more reason to NOT date a woman who also has kids. Meanwhile, the fact is, there have never been so many young, hot, childfree women. Women are waiting until later to have children, if they have them at all.

2) It's what he knows. He was raised by a single mother, and this is what he knows. He might even be trying to fix what he saw was wrong with his own childhood. He's going to be a better man, in his mind, than his biological father was, or the other men his mother dated.

3) He's playing Captain Saveahoe. He wants to feel like a rescuer, like a hero, like somebody needed him, so he's "saving" a woman in distress.

4) He's looking for a mother. He actually identifies with her children. He figures she's already used to taking care of dependents, and he wants her to take care of him.

5) He wants kids, and he doesn't have viable sperm or doesn't want to further his own genes. Rather than adopt, he's going with a ready-made family.

6) He has a cuckold fetish. He gets off on raising the biological children of other men.

7) He's a predator. He's hoping to (continue to) "have sex with" (abuse) at least one of her kids, with or without her. Think about pedophiles. If they have an option of a woman with kids or a woman without kids, guess who they're more likely to choose?

It's important to keep in mind that television shows and movies are FICTIONAL. You may have watched shows and movies in which a guy dates and even marries a single mother and everything turns out great. Yeah, that's extremely rare. Literally. The vast majority of times, things will NOT be great. 70% of marriages in which there are prior children divorce, and that's just divorce. It doesn't even count the terrible marriages which never legally divorce.

Dating a single mother is usually going to be trouble; it will almost certainly be extra work for less reward. Marrying one is even worse than marrying a woman who doesn't have kids yet.

There ARE alternatives, guys! Let me say it again: There have never been so many young, hot, childfree women. Women are waiting until later to have children, if they have them at all. Get a vasectomy and date younger women.

You can find childfree women even if you're not rich, even if you're older, even if you're out of shape or not attractive, and even if you have children of your own. All you need to do is run some game.

You are NOT obligated to date or be with a woman with kids. In fact, the way I (and people like Dr. Laura) figure it, you're morally obligated to AVOID dating single mothers.

If you're dating or with a woman with one of more children, here's how to get out.

You can leave comments below, but this is also a good place to comment.

Keeping Boundaries as a Free Man

It’s Not Too Early to Form Your Holiday Game Plan

Free Men, and men who want to be, it's NOT to early to think about the holidays, and by that, I mean Halloween, Thanksgiving, Hanukah, Christmas, New Years, and Valentine's Day. 

There are two main considerations for you:

1) Dealing with family and "friends" who will be asking you (or pestering you) about your status as a free man. You know how it goes. "When are you going to get married?" Questions like that.

2) Avoiding spending those special days with a woman who wants to take away your status as Free Man, or will be expecting you to spend a lot of time, money, and effort on her.

Don't do something something foolish and start thinking there is "the one" to whom you should hand over your freedom. Don't be so ignorant, delusional, or masochistic that you're thinking you want to be exclusive with a woman.

Answering Marriage Seller Assertions, Talking Points, and Questions - Part 10

Read Part 1 here and Part 2 here and Part 3 here and Part 4 here and Part 5 here and Part 6 here and Part 7 here and Part 8 here and Part 9 here.

Single men waste a lot of time and money running around chasing women.

So do a lot of married men!

But seriously, when a man signs a terrible state contract, his money and time are no longer his own. They are controlled by his wife. Marriage sellers think that is a good thing, and not wasteful.

The men who try this argument reveal that they considered what they did/do when unmarried to be a waste. And maybe it was. Whether the time and money he spends is a waste is up to him to decide.

But many unmarried men, especially free men who know what they're doing, which might include running game, don't waste much time or money and are very much happy with being unmarried.

If a man runs game, he won't be spending a lot of time and money. He's definitely spending less than a husband, though a common complaint of wives is that their husband isn't spending a lot of time and money "chasing" her. How is buying overpriced flowers that will be withered and discarded soon, or chocolates for an obese wife NOT wasting money? You know what a waste of money is? Paying for two sets of divorce lawyers because you entered into a terrible state contract even though you didn't need to.

If you're really so worried that "single" men are wasting time and money how about showing them how to live the life they want for less time and money spent, instead of urging them to sign a terrible state contract?

Part 11

Being Free Isn’t Being Deficient

 

You are a complete person.

You’re sufficient.

You don’t need a spouse, a partner, or whatever anyone wants to call another person to be a complete person and to live a great, productive, honorable, worthwhile life.

Yes, we’re all flawed. Yes, we all have our limitations. Yes, we all need other people to do things or we won’t have food, shelter, etc. (And yes, I believe we all need Jesus.)

But you are a complete person. Having Jesus + a wife won’t save you. The wife doesn’t factor in to your salvation.

You can have a residence, contribute to society, have a great career, be a good friend, and all of that without a wife, a partner, or a girlfriend.

You don’t need someone living with you, having any control over how you live, what you do, how you decorate, what you eat, what you watch, when you go to bed, when you wake up. You don’t need someone there costing you money, taking up your time, nagging you, criticizing you, arguing with you, interfering with your life.

You’re sufficient.

One Way to Warn More Men

If you identify at all with MGTOW or agree with me that most men should stay Free Men (avoiding legal/financial entanglements with women) or at least avoid marriage, one way to get our messages out to more men is to use established platforms, such as online discussions, comments sections, and call-in shows (like talk radio).

Getting a single sentence broadcast can help change lives for the better. If you can red-pill just one man or boy listening, it makes a positive difference. Any show doing an hour or whatever of "open lines" or allowing “talk back” of messages recorded using their app (no set topic) is an opportunity, but especially shows or spaces talking about relationships, dating, family, or marriage.

I wrote an extensive open letter to Dennis Prager, but I'd never call in to his show, for reasons, but you might be able to [at this time, he’s not doing live shows other than tsking some questions from paid subscribers on occasion]. Although I'll be using Dennis Prager and Dr. Laura as examples, you can adapt these tactics to any call-in show, preferably one that puts "live" calls on the air. Note that Dennis Prager does live question and answer chats on Facebook [he did.. he might resume as he recovers from his spinal injury] and Dr. Laura's show has a Facebook page where she allows comments and discussions on things she posts, which are often about relationships and marriage. You can adapt these messages for any forum, social media, or comments area. 

Men Are Not In The Mood

 

Whether from simps, or from family ministries, sociologists, and other marriage sellers, or from feminists, we often see assertions that men need to do this or that.

Sometimes it’s husbands specifically, or men in relationships, or men in general.

And to that I say, “Men aren’t in the mood.”

Haven’t we been told that if someone isn’t in the mood to do something, it’s a severe transgression to demand they do it anyway, or to even accept them “voluntarily” doing it?

Oh, sure, someone might say “That’s specifically for women and/or about having sex.”

But we’ve also been told that men and women are equal and interchangeable and that sex is just another activity like so many others.

So… “I’m not in the mood” is an entirely valid way to decline an assignment or demand.

Try it. Especially in social media. I do this. When you see someone saying what men should do or must do, respond with “We’re not in the mood.” For individuals, it’s “He’s not in the mood.” For you, it’s “I’m not in the mood.”

Men are not in the mood.

Deal with it.

Another Reason to Remain Unmarried and Free

There are many reasons to stay unmarried, and I've listed some of them before here.

I've also discussed how Free Men can be morally superior to married men.

I recently realized another very important reason for men to remain unmarried and free.

I've seen repeated claims that we can't be sure a woman who is performing on a webcam isn't being trafficked. By the very same thinking, we can't be sure any woman who we'd marry isn't being trafficked into the marriage. She might say she's not, but maybe that's because she's being threatened to say she isn't.

There is a long history of trafficking fueling marriage and marriage fueling trafficking. Marriage wouldn't be where it is today without trafficking, and trafficking wouldn't be where it is today without marriage.

So, men, the only way to be sure you're not perpetuating trafficking of brides is to avoid marriage.

Stay free, men!

"Is It OK For Spouse to Withhold Sex?"

Someone came here by that search. [This entry is bumped up because it is still relevant.]

It used to be cultural and legally understood in this country that sex and marriage went hand-in-hand, so to speak. We can go all the way back to the Puritans, and if a wife told her friends her husband wasn't giving it to her as often as he should, word would inevitably get to other men in the community and that guy would be confronted. Withholding can be seen as a form of cheating. You're cheating your spouse out of something they should have.

Up until recent times, this concept of sex and marriage being necessarily intertwined continued. Unrelated men and women had no right to live together or even share a hotel room together, and in some places could be prosecuted for doing so. Marriages could be considered null if they were never "consummated" with intercourse. Husbands could rape their wives without violating a law, because her body, or at least her sexuality, belonged to him (and his to her... people forget that part). Adultery was grounds for divorce and could impact the outcome of the divorce. Affair partners can still, in a few places, be successfully sued by the scorned spouse for "alienation of affection". To this day, when a married person is a plaintiff in a lawsuit, their spouse can join in, depending, claiming a loss of consortium (less or no sex because of wrongs done to the spouse by the entity being sued).

The question about whether it is OK for a spouse to withhold sex has to be addressed to someone, though.

How to Break Up

So you're a guy dating a woman and you want out of the relationship.

This is about a situation in which you don't have any serious entanglements other than social: you're not married or engaged, not living together, you have no kids together, she doesn't have minor children who have bonded with you, you don't own anything major together. You're boyfriend-girlfriend or some equivalent. When Running Game, you don't need to break up - you simply stop seeing her. Breaking up is for when you haven't been running game, at least when it comes to this woman, so you've allowed the situation to get to the point you're a couple. That's the situation you're in now.

The point of breaking up is for freedom and personal protection. Maybe you want to reclaim your freedom. Maybe you're being proactive in protecting yourself. Maybe she's trying to move the relationship towards financial transfers or entanglements, living together, marrying, or having children. Maybe you want to be a Free Man. Maybe she's done something for which you have zero tolerance, or she's reached strike three. Maybe she's withdrawn or denied affection.

PLEASE NOTE: If you haven't had a vasectomy, you might want to wait for her period to make sure she's not pregnant, then never give her access to your sperm again as you commence the breakup plan. "Oopsie" pregnancies seem to happen a lot when a relationship is on its way to ending, and some women use fake pregnancy tests or tests shared or sold by pregnant women to mess with a man. ALSO, you might want to safely retain any media or communications with and from her that would disprove any false allegations against you of assault/rape, harassment, or any other forms of abuse.

Which way or doing a break up is best?

A) Dump her cold turkey with either 1) an announcement or 2) going ghost?

B) Get her to dump you?

C) Break routines and get more distant?

How To Avoid Single Women With Kids

Someone came here by searching "how to avoid single women with kids."

The most popular entry here is a warning not to date single mothers. You can see for yourself there are hundreds of comments on it.

Of course, you can avoid single women with kids by avoiding women entirely. That fail-safe solution isn't for everyone, though, especially if your a self-destructive masochist who actually wants to get married.

So how does a guy avoid single women with kids (single mothers), especially since more and more women are mothers the older they get?

Hang out in the pet store by the cat supplies.

But seriously, simply pay attention. Most single mothers won't stop talking about their kids, or will badmouth "the father of my kid(s)". In online dating profiles, their kids will often be in their pictures, even though there really isn't a good reason to show complete strangers pictures of their kids unless they're trying to attract pedophiles.

Any woman who hides the fact she has kids is definitely bad news. If you're just looking for sex, there's a chance a woman who hides or omits that she has children is also just looking for sex, and so you might think that's a good thing. But ask yourself... how did she become a single mother in the first place? By other men who were just getting together with her for sex? Stay away, unless you have had a vasectomy, and even then, you should probably heed the warning against dating single mothers.

How do you smoke out a single mother who is hiding the fact that she's a mother?

Perhaps by moving things to her place as soon as you can. You don't want her coming back to your place, anyway. If she's reluctant to let you see her place, she might also be thinking about her safety and convenience, or it might be a mess, or she might live with her husband(!), or she might have kids.

It would take a lot of work for her to remove signs of being a mother from around her place. She could try to pass off the other bedrooms as roommates' rooms.

It doesn't matter how things are going, or how attractive you find her. Once you realize she has kids, especially if she hid it, and especially if you haven't had a vasectomy, you need to drop her immediately. Leave. Ghost her.

If you have any tactics that work for you, please do share them in the comments.

Get a Vasectomy

Hey, you... sir... yes, you.

Chances are, whatever your situation, getting a vasectomy will be one of the best things you can do for yourself (if you're not already shooting blanks.)

Why? Because children take a lot of time, money, and energy, and complicate your life. They also tie you to a woman for the rest of life (with the possible exception of using a donated egg and rented womb). And, chances are, you can't provide a new child with a stable, lasting, loving, healthy marital home in which that child will be raised.

Whether you have children or not, you should probably get a vasectomy.

If you are 50 or older, you're too old to raise kids from birth, regardless of your wife's age, and you should definitely get a vasectomy.

But you should probably get one if you're younger, too.

If you aren't eager to have a(nother) child, you should probably get a vasectomy.

If you can't come up with a logical, coherent, rational, unselfish reason why you should have a(nother) kid, don't make a new child. This would be another human being we're talking about. Doing it because she wants it isn't a good reason. And you definitely shouldn't have a child if you already have a child (who wasn't adopted away) with a different woman, or if you aren't sure 1) you're with a woman who is good mother material, 2) you want to be with her for the long haul, 3) you're compatible, and 4) there are no red flags. (That pretty much means you shouldn't have a kid.)

I can give you reasons NOT to have a(nother) kid.

As I always say, I can't address every religion. I know there are religions out there that tell men not to get vasectomies. What I can tell you is that there is no Biblical command to avoid getting a vasectomy.

Condoms and other methods of contraception aren't 100-percent effective. Pulling out is not effective. Condoms are not always effective, women have been known to poke holes in them or retrieve the contents, women have tried to get themselves pregnant via “outercourse”.

The surgery itself is easy to go through. Mine was virtually painless. After having it lab tested a couple of times, it removes so much worry and uncertainty and risk. It reduces the amount of power any woman will have over you. Remember that each sperm cell a woman gets from you is like you handing her a blank check.

Even if you think you'll never have intercourse or any other kind of sex again, at least not with a fertile woman, get a vasectomy. Things change. And as strange as it sounds, a woman can still get your sperm even if you don't choose to have sex with her, such as by retrieving some after you masturbate or have a nocturnal emission or by assaulting you while you sleep. So, get a vasectomy to ensure that can't happen.

If you're worried that you might change your mind, freeze some sperm. But NEVER allow that frozen sperm to be donated.

So, ask your general doctor for a referral to get a vasectomy. Do not let anyone talk you out of it. This should be YOUR decision, not anyone else's.

One of the most basic things a man can do to protect himself, protect his life, protect his finances, and prevent himself from having to deal with a bitter, irrational creature who hates his guts is to get a vasectomy.


Motivations for Going Child Free

What A Woman Can Do With Your DNA

You Can Persuade Rather Than Parent

To What Should Males Aspire?

Who Leads the Home?

Most men have a strong drive to have sex with women, especially the woman he's serving in marriage.

Most men don't want to argue or disagree with their wife, or have her nagging or whining or complaining to him.

Most women marry men who do, or will, earn more income than them.

These realities, along with family law and courts, and domestic violence laws and policies, mean that men lose their power when they marry. Husbands have power at the delegation of their wife. She can rescind that power at any time.

These things mean that if the wife doesn't let her husband be the leader, she will be the leader.

"Oh, we decide together."

It might look that way, especially when what he wants/chooses is something she would choose if it was entirely up to her. But husbands will often try to avoid conflict with their wife, so unless she truly defers to him, he's going to defer to her when there is disagreement. He may be so good at that she might not even realize it is what he is doing, or she might think he doesn't really care either way (even though he might care very much).

There are only two people. If each gets one vote, and they don't agree, what's the solution? When a husband takes the lead, and the wife doesn't accept his decisions, she's likely to call him inconsiderate, immature, controlling, or some other negative descriptor.

In my home, my wife has said in the past that she wants me to make more of the decisions. However, when I decide differently than she would, she says I didn't listen to her. I did listen to her! I listened and still decided the way I wanted was the better choice. She's not happy with that. So, it's better to talk with her, figure out what she wants, and unless it's sure to be significantly destructive, "agree" with her or "decide" the way she wants.

This is one more reason not to marry, as free men don't have to deal with this. Live alone, and you always get to decide. But if you're going to be foolish enough to marry, try to have this worked out ahead of time: How are decisions made? How are disputes settled? She might not stick with whatever she says before you marry her, but you can at least try. If you really want to subject yourself to marriage.